1 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:38,110 [Music] 2 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:40,370 welcome to the skinwalker debrief I'm 3 00:00:44,750 --> 00:00:42,330 your host TJ Lord and I'm one of the 4 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:44,760 executive producers of the TV series on 5 00:00:49,760 --> 00:00:47,010 history called the secret of skinwalker 6 00:00:51,290 --> 00:00:49,770 ranch and I'm joined each week by Jason 7 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:51,300 McClellan and Marine Ellsbury and 8 00:00:55,729 --> 00:00:53,610 together we'll dissect each episode to 9 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:55,739 give you more insight into the show and 10 00:00:59,290 --> 00:00:57,210 we'll bring on some guests and get a 11 00:01:01,430 --> 00:00:59,300 little uh little background info as well 12 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:01,440 Jason's been exploring all the strange 13 00:01:05,540 --> 00:01:03,090 for more than a decade and he's appeared 14 00:01:08,030 --> 00:01:05,550 on Nat Geo sci-fi and history and he's 15 00:01:09,499 --> 00:01:08,040 the author of only weirdos see UFOs an 16 00:01:11,210 --> 00:01:09,509 introduction to the public's 17 00:01:13,940 --> 00:01:11,220 misperception of unidentified aerial 18 00:01:15,859 --> 00:01:13,950 phenomenon and extraterrestrial life and 19 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:15,869 Maureen is a journalist researcher and 20 00:01:20,510 --> 00:01:18,210 podcaster specializing in the anomalous 21 00:01:22,850 --> 00:01:20,520 she starred in a docu-series uncovering 22 00:01:24,170 --> 00:01:22,860 aliens on Animal Planet and has served 23 00:01:26,810 --> 00:01:24,180 as the ambassador for science channels 24 00:01:28,580 --> 00:01:26,820 are we alone initiatives and tonight 25 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:28,590 we'd like to welcome for the very first 26 00:01:32,900 --> 00:01:30,570 time to the show the ranch manager of 27 00:01:33,820 --> 00:01:32,910 skinwalker ranch Jim Morris Jim thank 28 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:33,830 you for joining us 29 00:01:41,090 --> 00:01:36,810 Thank You TJ my pleasure it's good to be 30 00:01:43,370 --> 00:01:41,100 with you guys and once again somebody we 31 00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:43,380 all say hi awesome it's great to have 32 00:01:49,279 --> 00:01:46,170 you so Jim and you know I know you've 33 00:01:50,809 --> 00:01:49,289 we've talked before and you've heard the 34 00:01:52,730 --> 00:01:50,819 podcast so we're just gonna talk about 35 00:01:54,889 --> 00:01:52,740 last week's episode and we'll ask you 36 00:01:57,770 --> 00:01:54,899 some questions kind of recap it with you 37 00:01:59,300 --> 00:01:57,780 and get your experiences there your take 38 00:02:01,219 --> 00:01:59,310 on things and then we're gonna open it 39 00:02:04,520 --> 00:02:01,229 up to some questions that we took from 40 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:04,530 from the internet okay awesome 41 00:02:11,540 --> 00:02:07,170 so this week's episode was surveillance 42 00:02:13,460 --> 00:02:11,550 episode 7 surveillance it was the big 43 00:02:15,470 --> 00:02:13,470 the big talking point here is the 44 00:02:18,410 --> 00:02:15,480 besides the surveillance is a dead cow 45 00:02:21,050 --> 00:02:18,420 that is on land so why don't you tell us 46 00:02:23,479 --> 00:02:21,060 a little bit Jim about your experience 47 00:02:25,460 --> 00:02:23,489 when that happened like where were you 48 00:02:27,670 --> 00:02:25,470 and you know what was going through your 49 00:02:31,370 --> 00:02:27,680 head when all this was going on yeah 50 00:02:35,540 --> 00:02:31,380 thanks for the question TJ I was there 51 00:02:40,899 --> 00:02:35,550 on premise at the time you know when I 52 00:02:43,390 --> 00:02:40,909 that calf that cow went down in a blind 53 00:02:46,100 --> 00:02:43,400 Frank with you I mean it was healthy 54 00:02:47,780 --> 00:02:46,110 earlier that day and then when we 55 00:02:51,350 --> 00:02:47,790 basically did a 56 00:02:55,309 --> 00:02:51,360 perimeter area property check that the 57 00:02:56,209 --> 00:02:55,319 cow was down and somewhat alarming to 58 00:02:58,520 --> 00:02:56,219 say the least 59 00:03:02,959 --> 00:02:58,530 and at that point we brought the science 60 00:03:06,199 --> 00:03:02,969 team to the to where the little calf 61 00:03:10,009 --> 00:03:06,209 went down unfortunately we had to bring 62 00:03:12,920 --> 00:03:10,019 in the vet and there were some things 63 00:03:14,390 --> 00:03:12,930 that happened and again I apologize I 64 00:03:16,970 --> 00:03:14,400 didn't get a chance to see this past 65 00:03:19,940 --> 00:03:16,980 episode but I was there living and 66 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:19,950 observing there was something that was 67 00:03:27,679 --> 00:03:24,090 detected from our command center that 68 00:03:30,860 --> 00:03:27,689 obviously was a as Travis Taylor says a 69 00:03:34,429 --> 00:03:30,870 UFO or a UFO unidentified flying object 70 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:34,439 and it was almost as if when this object 71 00:03:42,099 --> 00:03:39,530 was over the cattle that this happened I 72 00:03:49,309 --> 00:03:42,109 can't help but also notice that there's 73 00:03:52,879 --> 00:03:49,319 something happening here it looks like 74 00:03:56,869 --> 00:03:52,889 an object above the tree and it happens 75 00:04:00,439 --> 00:03:56,879 right when the cow move raises up so as 76 00:04:04,189 --> 00:04:00,449 I was talking to the fat his feeling was 77 00:04:06,710 --> 00:04:04,199 it was it was due to stress and through 78 00:04:09,610 --> 00:04:06,720 this stress it could cause the pneumonia 79 00:04:13,039 --> 00:04:09,620 or you know whatever the analogy was 80 00:04:16,640 --> 00:04:13,049 this was an interesting phenomenon to 81 00:04:21,080 --> 00:04:16,650 the point that they flew in Linda if it 82 00:04:22,610 --> 00:04:21,090 had been a classic cattle mutilation the 83 00:04:25,990 --> 00:04:22,620 first thing you would do is you would 84 00:04:29,170 --> 00:04:26,000 look at the sky facing head 85 00:04:33,190 --> 00:04:29,180 and that is where the sky facing ear 86 00:04:36,220 --> 00:04:33,200 would be gone sky facing I would be 87 00:04:39,010 --> 00:04:36,230 removed and often in a circle of flesh 88 00:04:45,010 --> 00:04:39,020 around taking out the eyeball the 89 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:45,020 eyelids and a perfect circle I think 90 00:04:51,400 --> 00:04:47,090 there's still some ongoing investigation 91 00:04:53,590 --> 00:04:51,410 in regards to this yes there's more we 92 00:04:54,400 --> 00:04:53,600 get into more the next episode so I'd 93 00:04:58,150 --> 00:04:54,410 want to know 94 00:05:00,760 --> 00:04:58,160 we don't give too much away yeah but so 95 00:05:03,159 --> 00:05:00,770 Jason in marine you guys are familiar 96 00:05:03,820 --> 00:05:03,169 with Linda and her work right yeah 97 00:05:08,290 --> 00:05:03,830 absolutely 98 00:05:10,570 --> 00:05:08,300 we we've known Linda for years and a lot 99 00:05:14,020 --> 00:05:10,580 of other cattle mutilation experts as 100 00:05:17,460 --> 00:05:14,030 well Chuck Zukowski and one people so we 101 00:05:21,550 --> 00:05:17,470 were quite versed on on this subject 102 00:05:22,690 --> 00:05:21,560 yeah your thoughts after seeing after 103 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:22,700 seeing good I mean it doesn't fall into 104 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:23,930 the traditional category of the 105 00:05:30,580 --> 00:05:26,410 mutilation but I mean it it kind of 106 00:05:34,270 --> 00:05:30,590 loosely encompasses all of encompasses 107 00:05:38,950 --> 00:05:34,280 it then I should say I think it's at 108 00:05:40,840 --> 00:05:38,960 strange cattle death and related to 109 00:05:43,750 --> 00:05:40,850 stress at this point and as Jim 110 00:05:46,950 --> 00:05:43,760 mentioned the vet said stress-related 111 00:05:50,590 --> 00:05:46,960 pneumonia which came on super suddenly 112 00:05:54,610 --> 00:05:50,600 within a matter of hours so that's 113 00:05:58,659 --> 00:05:54,620 unique but there were no visceral damage 114 00:06:01,719 --> 00:05:58,669 no predator marks or anything no laser 115 00:06:05,740 --> 00:06:01,729 cuts so this is outside of the box and 116 00:06:08,440 --> 00:06:05,750 Jason maybe you have a different point 117 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:08,450 of view yeah for sure so I mean let me 118 00:06:12,070 --> 00:06:09,770 even point it out on the show there's 119 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:12,080 something that it makes this a unique 120 00:06:17,020 --> 00:06:14,210 situation yeah she points out this is 121 00:06:19,390 --> 00:06:17,030 not a typical mutilation scenario but 122 00:06:22,180 --> 00:06:19,400 what does make this unique is the fact 123 00:06:24,969 --> 00:06:22,190 that this is an active research lab 124 00:06:28,060 --> 00:06:24,979 essentially and we had have a team there 125 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:28,070 with instruments who were able to you 126 00:06:31,540 --> 00:06:29,330 know look at eeehm stuff that was 127 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:31,550 happening around the cow right in that 128 00:06:35,450 --> 00:06:34,130 area right we see Caleb's phone going 129 00:06:38,570 --> 00:06:35,460 crazy 130 00:06:41,300 --> 00:06:38,580 we see the the Trifield meters picking 131 00:06:44,659 --> 00:06:41,310 up you know these this elevated e/m 132 00:06:46,700 --> 00:06:44,669 levels so that being able to have that 133 00:06:49,249 --> 00:06:46,710 how the the instruments there to take 134 00:06:51,290 --> 00:06:49,259 readings and determine that that stuff 135 00:06:53,719 --> 00:06:51,300 is happening in proximity to where this 136 00:06:56,450 --> 00:06:53,729 cow was that is pretty interesting 137 00:06:58,939 --> 00:06:56,460 pretty unique and pretty exciting and 138 00:07:02,870 --> 00:06:58,949 and let's just start by giving caleb a 139 00:07:04,790 --> 00:07:02,880 shout-out for making everyone get get 140 00:07:06,950 --> 00:07:04,800 away and treat it like a natural crime 141 00:07:13,909 --> 00:07:06,960 scene because that is okay we important 142 00:07:18,290 --> 00:07:13,919 so yeah real deal you know he's an 143 00:07:20,300 --> 00:07:18,300 ex-marine guy biceps are bigger than my 144 00:07:22,580 --> 00:07:20,310 thighs I was just about to say I was 145 00:07:25,610 --> 00:07:22,590 just about to comment knowing this guy 146 00:07:26,740 --> 00:07:25,620 is the steady as they go I always feel 147 00:07:30,439 --> 00:07:26,750 very much 148 00:07:34,029 --> 00:07:30,449 insulated a lot of mine know that he's 149 00:07:37,100 --> 00:07:34,039 our True North out there he's also 150 00:07:37,969 --> 00:07:37,110 County Sheriff out there too so this guy 151 00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:37,979 is the real deal 152 00:07:45,740 --> 00:07:41,250 he insulates the ranch he's very 153 00:07:47,420 --> 00:07:45,750 conscientious about his actions and as 154 00:07:50,029 --> 00:07:47,430 we've talked about you know my actions 155 00:07:52,159 --> 00:07:50,039 reflection on you and vice versa and 156 00:07:55,310 --> 00:07:52,169 that's the way he's very accountable out 157 00:07:59,260 --> 00:07:55,320 there but it would be fun to get him on 158 00:08:02,029 --> 00:07:59,270 as on an interview with you guys he's 159 00:08:05,589 --> 00:08:02,039 he's an amazing human being he's got a 160 00:08:09,860 --> 00:08:05,599 value system that is very very rare 161 00:08:13,670 --> 00:08:09,870 great family man has a no fear factor 162 00:08:16,159 --> 00:08:13,680 about him and firsthand with him he's my 163 00:08:21,499 --> 00:08:16,169 shadow out there yeah very cool calm 164 00:08:23,450 --> 00:08:21,509 collective but he's a combat marine but 165 00:08:26,659 --> 00:08:23,460 he's got a value system that is very 166 00:08:28,969 --> 00:08:26,669 very rare for a young man 167 00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:28,979 so we're blessed were very fortunate to 168 00:08:34,490 --> 00:08:32,010 have him as a confidant and a shadow as 169 00:08:35,630 --> 00:08:34,500 you say out there on the ranch and he 170 00:08:37,430 --> 00:08:35,640 did you're right Maureen he had the 171 00:08:39,139 --> 00:08:37,440 wherewithal to kind of make sure people 172 00:08:41,569 --> 00:08:39,149 weren't contaminating anything and I 173 00:08:43,850 --> 00:08:41,579 think that kind of you know goes right 174 00:08:46,370 --> 00:08:43,860 toward the the goal here of the show 175 00:08:47,660 --> 00:08:46,380 which is let's try to get some science 176 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:47,670 behind this let's try to get some actual 177 00:08:50,639 --> 00:08:48,850 data in 178 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:50,649 you know move away from all the 179 00:08:54,809 --> 00:08:52,810 speculation and the fact that he did 180 00:08:56,430 --> 00:08:54,819 that aloud allowed the cage to go up 181 00:08:58,110 --> 00:08:56,440 allowed people to get the readings and 182 00:09:01,259 --> 00:08:58,120 stuff and then watch and observe that 183 00:09:03,180 --> 00:09:01,269 that carcass for however long I mean you 184 00:09:06,329 --> 00:09:03,190 don't want to go too deep into it but so 185 00:09:08,249 --> 00:09:06,339 Jim I I had a question the Deadland 186 00:09:10,680 --> 00:09:08,259 there you know the the Native American 187 00:09:11,910 --> 00:09:10,690 land was there or had there been it 188 00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:11,920 there may or may not have been I mean I 189 00:09:16,290 --> 00:09:13,930 don't know but reports in the past not 190 00:09:18,930 --> 00:09:16,300 just on the ranch but in the surrounding 191 00:09:22,079 --> 00:09:18,940 areas at all of mutilations in the past 192 00:09:25,259 --> 00:09:22,089 you know a few decades do you have any 193 00:09:28,650 --> 00:09:25,269 yes absolutely you know you need to talk 194 00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:28,660 about ley lines and and in that area 195 00:09:34,379 --> 00:09:31,810 over you know many decades now there has 196 00:09:35,910 --> 00:09:34,389 been reports of these cattle mutilations 197 00:09:38,460 --> 00:09:35,920 that have happened very fast 198 00:09:40,980 --> 00:09:38,470 little or no blood the like the 199 00:09:43,949 --> 00:09:40,990 incisions have been been done with a 200 00:09:47,069 --> 00:09:43,959 laser gone right through maybe the eye 201 00:09:51,509 --> 00:09:47,079 socket and out the other end 202 00:09:54,809 --> 00:09:51,519 another orifice and and yeah but on the 203 00:09:58,290 --> 00:09:54,819 ranch I have physically talked to the 204 00:10:00,199 --> 00:09:58,300 young man Sherman who witnessed it he 205 00:10:04,620 --> 00:10:00,209 was out there irrigating that morning 206 00:10:07,590 --> 00:10:04,630 you know he very stand-up guy went on an 207 00:10:10,259 --> 00:10:07,600 LDS mission came back from the mission 208 00:10:12,990 --> 00:10:10,269 Mary's got a really cute little family 209 00:10:15,870 --> 00:10:13,000 and we took the initiative to drive up 210 00:10:17,939 --> 00:10:15,880 to price to visit with him and when he 211 00:10:19,860 --> 00:10:17,949 stepped out kind of give us a little 212 00:10:22,350 --> 00:10:19,870 privacy his wife took the side and says 213 00:10:25,470 --> 00:10:22,360 you know this subject matter is even to 214 00:10:28,590 --> 00:10:25,480 this day is very very upsetting to him 215 00:10:30,170 --> 00:10:28,600 and it happened in a minute minute a few 216 00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:30,180 minutes you know him basically 217 00:10:35,610 --> 00:10:32,850 realigning some of the irrigation 218 00:10:39,329 --> 00:10:35,620 equipment and then came back and these 219 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:39,339 were these were prized Bulls so and this 220 00:10:43,340 --> 00:10:41,170 is not a guy that you could tell very 221 00:10:46,710 --> 00:10:43,350 quickly he's not an exaggerator 222 00:10:49,079 --> 00:10:46,720 it was pretty profound you know what he 223 00:10:51,780 --> 00:10:49,089 witnessed and what he he was willing to 224 00:10:55,650 --> 00:10:51,790 share with us but he was not willing to 225 00:10:58,379 --> 00:10:55,660 go on camera to be documented so as a 226 00:10:59,490 --> 00:10:58,389 former military guy you know move around 227 00:11:01,799 --> 00:10:59,500 a little bit more in that in that 228 00:11:03,670 --> 00:11:01,809 episode we also have the helicopter and 229 00:11:05,980 --> 00:11:03,680 the surveillance 230 00:11:07,940 --> 00:11:05,990 got a Skyfall on the bottom of it 231 00:11:14,270 --> 00:11:07,950 another thing this thing has a big 232 00:11:17,450 --> 00:11:14,280 camera on the bottom of it - they're 233 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:17,460 watching this guy's you know the set you 234 00:11:20,060 --> 00:11:18,930 know when you see it happening like 235 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:20,070 what's the first thought cycle in your 236 00:11:25,280 --> 00:11:21,930 in your head when you're seeing that 237 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:25,290 well you know for years I hate that you 238 00:11:30,110 --> 00:11:26,850 know I came out of the service being 239 00:11:32,540 --> 00:11:30,120 more effective operations guy that shot 240 00:11:34,940 --> 00:11:32,550 you know heavy weapons 90 millimeter 241 00:11:37,490 --> 00:11:34,950 recoilless and I was in and out of some 242 00:11:39,890 --> 00:11:37,500 third-world countries on helicopters and 243 00:11:42,770 --> 00:11:39,900 I hate to say it and not trying to be a 244 00:11:45,130 --> 00:11:42,780 crybaby here but there was years that I 245 00:11:49,310 --> 00:11:45,140 walked it off six seven years as a as a 246 00:11:52,610 --> 00:11:49,320 postal carrier mailman and just just a 247 00:11:56,180 --> 00:11:52,620 sound of helicopters come in made me 248 00:11:58,580 --> 00:11:56,190 weary you know so you know that day when 249 00:12:02,600 --> 00:11:58,590 that came in to be honest with you it 250 00:12:03,860 --> 00:12:02,610 was as if you know somebody was I I'm 251 00:12:05,660 --> 00:12:03,870 not gonna say they were trying to be 252 00:12:08,840 --> 00:12:05,670 obnoxious but they had no business 253 00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:08,850 coming over the skinwalker ranch and 254 00:12:16,160 --> 00:12:12,450 observing and they were there to take 255 00:12:18,140 --> 00:12:16,170 photos and and and they were off you 256 00:12:21,530 --> 00:12:18,150 know I mean Eric went into the command 257 00:12:22,970 --> 00:12:21,540 center and whatever they were doing they 258 00:12:26,570 --> 00:12:22,980 were not supposed to be there but that 259 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:26,580 that that Kimmi leo things like that 260 00:12:31,670 --> 00:12:29,970 happen out there in that wrench when we 261 00:12:33,980 --> 00:12:31,680 first went out there we would hear 262 00:12:37,700 --> 00:12:33,990 helicopters which couldn't see them and 263 00:12:42,110 --> 00:12:37,710 so you know this this ranch has been as 264 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:42,120 a petri petri dish for Bigelow and the 265 00:12:48,590 --> 00:12:45,090 sorts for many many years due to the 266 00:12:50,330 --> 00:12:48,600 fact that it is a remote area and you 267 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:50,340 know we would go out there we would hear 268 00:12:55,910 --> 00:12:53,490 hearing noises and they were literally 269 00:12:57,980 --> 00:12:55,920 within a rocks throw the church couldn't 270 00:13:01,370 --> 00:12:57,990 see it it was like I say we use it as 271 00:13:02,870 --> 00:13:01,380 they used it as camouflage but that that 272 00:13:05,330 --> 00:13:02,880 day that we were out there 273 00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:05,340 it was obvious it was just above us and 274 00:13:11,000 --> 00:13:07,770 and they were trying to detect what we 275 00:13:15,410 --> 00:13:11,010 were doing so and no business being that 276 00:13:16,060 --> 00:13:15,420 way did you guys have that did they just 277 00:13:17,770 --> 00:13:16,070 kind of self 278 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:17,780 I don't remember I know in the show they 279 00:13:21,790 --> 00:13:19,370 just kind of they they just wanted I've 280 00:13:24,250 --> 00:13:21,800 reached but there was no attempt to 281 00:13:26,020 --> 00:13:24,260 communicate with them or try to radio to 282 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:26,030 them or no one's shooting off flares or 283 00:13:28,750 --> 00:13:27,170 anything like that right I mean they 284 00:13:31,300 --> 00:13:28,760 just kind of went over the ridge and 285 00:13:33,670 --> 00:13:31,310 that was that was the end yeah that's it 286 00:13:35,350 --> 00:13:33,680 and there may be long going I mean we've 287 00:13:37,450 --> 00:13:35,360 had some people come out there with some 288 00:13:40,210 --> 00:13:37,460 of these drums and unfortunately it's 289 00:13:42,970 --> 00:13:40,220 private property and it hasn't worked 290 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:42,980 out well for how many down drones do you 291 00:13:50,590 --> 00:13:46,490 have in the skinwalker ranch sort of 292 00:13:53,050 --> 00:13:50,600 volt now yeah yeah there's been a few 293 00:13:56,170 --> 00:13:53,060 and I'll tell you you know we devised it 294 00:13:59,410 --> 00:13:56,180 we treat we treat that ranch as if it's 295 00:14:03,640 --> 00:13:59,420 area 51 and it's pretty obvious that 296 00:14:05,710 --> 00:14:03,650 when Bigelow ruled and controlled there 297 00:14:07,470 --> 00:14:05,720 was things going on that ranch that the 298 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:07,480 public really has no business being 299 00:14:12,730 --> 00:14:11,090 acknowledged absolutely it's for their 300 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:12,740 own benefit so I mean we've mentioned it 301 00:14:16,060 --> 00:14:14,330 before there's a lot about keeping other 302 00:14:17,500 --> 00:14:16,070 people safe like please don't show up at 303 00:14:19,810 --> 00:14:17,510 the ranch please don't go to the gate 304 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:19,820 please don't fly your drones around you 305 00:14:25,450 --> 00:14:23,690 know it's an active inactive scene I 306 00:14:27,790 --> 00:14:25,460 mean it's an it's an active experiment 307 00:14:30,700 --> 00:14:27,800 you know happening living experiment 308 00:14:32,470 --> 00:14:30,710 don't blow the investigation all right 309 00:14:34,450 --> 00:14:32,480 now we're in the investigation well it's 310 00:14:36,730 --> 00:14:34,460 funny a lot of the people come up they 311 00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:36,740 say oh we don't see any guard I will 312 00:14:44,410 --> 00:14:38,330 tell you the guard sees you or you 313 00:14:48,010 --> 00:14:44,420 exactly reach out in the tune of miles 314 00:14:51,460 --> 00:14:48,020 and and what's funny is some of the 315 00:14:54,790 --> 00:14:51,470 guards out there they're their ex ex 316 00:14:57,180 --> 00:14:54,800 vets and and you know some of these they 317 00:14:59,620 --> 00:14:57,190 call their camels their camouflage gear 318 00:15:01,720 --> 00:14:59,630 there's people who try to sneak in and 319 00:15:03,250 --> 00:15:01,730 we're literally an arm's length from 320 00:15:07,390 --> 00:15:03,260 them they're not even aware that our 321 00:15:12,790 --> 00:15:07,400 guards got eyes on them so dragons 322 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:12,800 waiting in the trees because I know that 323 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:15,290 those cameras now they're streaming to 324 00:15:19,540 --> 00:15:17,570 multiple it's not just in the command 325 00:15:21,750 --> 00:15:19,550 centre people are off-site and also 326 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:21,760 seeing those feeds at the same time so 327 00:15:28,690 --> 00:15:26,330 absolutely absolutely yeah it's quite a 328 00:15:29,500 --> 00:15:28,700 team and quite a team but it's then 329 00:15:32,500 --> 00:15:29,510 another day 330 00:15:35,890 --> 00:15:32,510 it's family and as I alluded before we 331 00:15:38,560 --> 00:15:35,900 started this we are and we do get very 332 00:15:42,310 --> 00:15:38,570 concerned about the well-being of each 333 00:15:44,650 --> 00:15:42,320 of us and it's an area unfortunately is 334 00:15:46,530 --> 00:15:44,660 a little tempting to people to want to 335 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:46,540 get in there and breach and 336 00:15:50,290 --> 00:15:48,410 unfortunately a lot of their underlying 337 00:15:52,660 --> 00:15:50,300 motivation is not as clear as it should 338 00:15:55,450 --> 00:15:52,670 be and you ain't get hurt on that ranch 339 00:15:58,030 --> 00:15:55,460 I mean you've got a lot of areas on that 340 00:16:01,120 --> 00:15:58,040 ranch that are unsafe especially at 341 00:16:05,170 --> 00:16:01,130 night where somebody sprained an ankle 342 00:16:06,670 --> 00:16:05,180 break a leg there's a serengeti they 343 00:16:09,550 --> 00:16:06,680 call it the south side of the ranch 344 00:16:13,450 --> 00:16:09,560 there is the Serengeti you know it's not 345 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:13,460 where is that is that where the cows 346 00:16:18,970 --> 00:16:16,250 ended up no they were on the west they 347 00:16:20,950 --> 00:16:18,980 were in the west side yeah yeah so Jim I 348 00:16:22,300 --> 00:16:20,960 know I mean besides this episode there 349 00:16:24,210 --> 00:16:22,310 was something they came up a couple 350 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:24,220 episodes ago a couple of our show's 351 00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:28,610 debrief episodes ago it's when we had 352 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:30,410 one of the Native American elders come 353 00:16:37,650 --> 00:16:35,530 out what yeah doctor watch 354 00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:37,660 [Music] 355 00:16:43,900 --> 00:16:40,930 but to us a name 356 00:16:45,780 --> 00:16:43,910 what you listening 357 00:16:47,769 --> 00:16:45,790 my cleaner 358 00:16:49,970 --> 00:16:47,779 [Music] 359 00:16:51,350 --> 00:16:49,980 what I would we didn't really talk about 360 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:51,360 it because we were hoping to get you on 361 00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:53,970 to go a little bit more into depth about 362 00:17:00,139 --> 00:16:56,370 that the situation when it came out and 363 00:17:01,760 --> 00:17:00,149 blessed land and kind of you know guided 364 00:17:03,139 --> 00:17:01,770 everyone if you want to talk about that 365 00:17:04,490 --> 00:17:03,149 that would be great we'd love to hear 366 00:17:08,150 --> 00:17:04,500 I know Maureen adjacent have questions 367 00:17:09,919 --> 00:17:08,160 about this as well be happy to as I said 368 00:17:12,980 --> 00:17:09,929 before you know I've always had a real 369 00:17:16,669 --> 00:17:12,990 sincere interest in that culture this 370 00:17:18,799 --> 00:17:16,679 particular I used to segment for men and 371 00:17:21,410 --> 00:17:18,809 very diplomatically in this particular 372 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:21,420 case Larry says pooch has said that Jim 373 00:17:27,470 --> 00:17:24,170 I'd rather be referred to as a medicine 374 00:17:30,500 --> 00:17:27,480 practitioner and it was interesting when 375 00:17:34,299 --> 00:17:30,510 when I asked him to get engaged or 376 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:34,309 involved on the ranch and he is you'd he 377 00:17:40,040 --> 00:17:37,650 had never been on the ranch before but 378 00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:40,050 for whatever reason the ranch somewhat 379 00:17:45,260 --> 00:17:42,210 embraced him and he embraced the ranch 380 00:17:47,510 --> 00:17:45,270 which was which was interesting because 381 00:17:50,450 --> 00:17:47,520 a lot of the natives are they're very 382 00:17:53,210 --> 00:17:50,460 superstitious one in particular as he 383 00:17:56,330 --> 00:17:53,220 drives home Hill as the ranch looked to 384 00:17:57,590 --> 00:17:56,340 the west he'll he'll look to the east he 385 00:17:58,940 --> 00:17:57,600 doesn't even want to acknowledge that 386 00:18:00,650 --> 00:17:58,950 the ranch is there is that that 387 00:18:04,730 --> 00:18:00,660 superstition it's kind of like saying 388 00:18:10,820 --> 00:18:04,740 Candyman 16 times I don't even bring the 389 00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:10,830 name and but the ranch when he got on 390 00:18:14,890 --> 00:18:12,690 the ranch obviously a lot of the 391 00:18:16,610 --> 00:18:14,900 producers and and some of the 392 00:18:19,820 --> 00:18:16,620 individuals out there that were 393 00:18:22,760 --> 00:18:19,830 participating kind of kind of looked at 394 00:18:25,270 --> 00:18:22,770 him with the level of curiosity and then 395 00:18:27,919 --> 00:18:25,280 they embraced him because I think the 396 00:18:30,890 --> 00:18:27,929 because obviously my respect and love 397 00:18:34,549 --> 00:18:30,900 for it not only Larry but the the Native 398 00:18:37,010 --> 00:18:34,559 American culture and he went out there 399 00:18:40,190 --> 00:18:37,020 and smudged you know took some sweet 400 00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:40,200 grass and his eagle feathers that Native 401 00:18:45,770 --> 00:18:42,450 Americans are legally only allowed to 402 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:45,780 have and in the case and I don't want to 403 00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:49,050 embarrass anybody but it was very very 404 00:18:53,450 --> 00:18:50,970 humbling 405 00:18:57,350 --> 00:18:53,460 you know what came to his mind's eye and 406 00:18:59,570 --> 00:18:57,360 what he repeated in prayer so you could 407 00:19:01,749 --> 00:18:59,580 almost sense that the the ground 408 00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:01,759 initially the skinwalker ranch 409 00:19:08,299 --> 00:19:05,570 looked at him with a level initially of 410 00:19:13,100 --> 00:19:08,309 curiosity almost it was kind of like 411 00:19:14,869 --> 00:19:13,110 trying to size his spirit up and and and 412 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:14,879 of course you know Larry was never out 413 00:19:21,619 --> 00:19:17,730 there to get overly aggressive or assert 414 00:19:24,610 --> 00:19:21,629 himself there was a level of peace that 415 00:19:28,340 --> 00:19:24,620 he brought to the ranch and I've always 416 00:19:30,590 --> 00:19:28,350 looked at the ranches as a woman as a 417 00:19:34,850 --> 00:19:30,600 lady and so you approach it with a level 418 00:19:37,549 --> 00:19:34,860 of finesse and and I always pray going 419 00:19:39,289 --> 00:19:37,559 in and pray going out you know I I do 420 00:19:43,009 --> 00:19:39,299 believe there are such a thing as 421 00:19:45,409 --> 00:19:43,019 spirits or hitchhikers and as we've 422 00:19:49,340 --> 00:19:45,419 talked about TJ if you going and you've 423 00:19:52,310 --> 00:19:49,350 got a overwhelm nosov issues whether 424 00:19:55,759 --> 00:19:52,320 they be financial or personal they 425 00:19:58,700 --> 00:19:55,769 compound and so I try to go into the 426 00:20:01,070 --> 00:19:58,710 ranch and try to leave my personal 427 00:20:04,490 --> 00:20:01,080 burdens at the gate and try to be as 428 00:20:06,169 --> 00:20:04,500 transparent as I can with with the 429 00:20:09,110 --> 00:20:06,179 property or the ground or the skinwalker 430 00:20:11,419 --> 00:20:09,120 ranch because that property is very 431 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:11,429 complex I think there's more than 432 00:20:16,100 --> 00:20:15,210 obviously one spirit there and it's very 433 00:20:19,940 --> 00:20:16,110 random 434 00:20:23,090 --> 00:20:19,950 so I'm conscientious in Larry's case I 435 00:20:25,909 --> 00:20:23,100 think that native I think I think the 436 00:20:30,230 --> 00:20:25,919 spirit was very receptive it embraced 437 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:30,240 him with the level of respect and and 438 00:20:34,519 --> 00:20:32,970 and I was so pleased to hear again I 439 00:20:36,590 --> 00:20:34,529 don't see all the episodes I was so 440 00:20:40,220 --> 00:20:36,600 pleased to hear that the directors or 441 00:20:43,549 --> 00:20:40,230 producers asked him to go out there and 442 00:20:47,360 --> 00:20:43,559 bless the ground and ask permission to 443 00:20:49,129 --> 00:20:47,370 dig and so it's really really pleased to 444 00:20:52,159 --> 00:20:49,139 hear that a matter of fact you know I 445 00:20:53,629 --> 00:20:52,169 value the science of what they're doing 446 00:20:56,210 --> 00:20:53,639 I think that that's that's wonderful 447 00:20:58,999 --> 00:20:56,220 it's great but I don't want to forget 448 00:21:02,330 --> 00:20:59,009 the spirit the spiritual side of that 449 00:21:04,399 --> 00:21:02,340 property out there and in you know my 450 00:21:06,830 --> 00:21:04,409 experience out there in the show who's 451 00:21:07,730 --> 00:21:06,840 happens to be with you I think the first 452 00:21:10,820 --> 00:21:07,740 time I was there 453 00:21:13,249 --> 00:21:10,830 luckily Michelle give me she give me as 454 00:21:14,620 --> 00:21:13,259 a stone men teachers calling her the 455 00:21:18,490 --> 00:21:14,630 power stone 456 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:18,500 that and I you know it was all new to me 457 00:21:23,410 --> 00:21:21,530 it was a whole just crazy and luckily I 458 00:21:25,330 --> 00:21:23,420 mean that was really that was my first 459 00:21:27,730 --> 00:21:25,340 experience out there and I didn't have 460 00:21:30,580 --> 00:21:27,740 any any negative side effects or 461 00:21:31,990 --> 00:21:30,590 anything bad till my leader visits you 462 00:21:34,150 --> 00:21:32,000 know but her she did the first time 463 00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:34,160 worked I think that's her for it every 464 00:21:40,900 --> 00:21:34,930 time 465 00:21:43,390 --> 00:21:40,910 but thanks Michelle I think there's a 466 00:21:45,550 --> 00:21:43,400 spirit to just about everything you know 467 00:21:48,010 --> 00:21:45,560 you go through some of these impact 468 00:21:51,610 --> 00:21:48,020 trainings and things and they talked 469 00:21:54,670 --> 00:21:51,620 about you you know realigning yourself 470 00:21:57,780 --> 00:21:54,680 with a tree or mother nature and boy 471 00:22:01,680 --> 00:21:57,790 that ground has got a concentration of 472 00:22:04,750 --> 00:22:01,690 feelings and vibes and frequencies and 473 00:22:08,230 --> 00:22:04,760 it's a moving target every time I go out 474 00:22:11,290 --> 00:22:08,240 there it seems like it's a mood swing so 475 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:11,300 so I don't take it for granted I hold my 476 00:22:18,100 --> 00:22:14,690 breath a lot of times probably one of 477 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:18,110 the biggest radar detectors is is our 478 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:20,530 dog out there William it seems like he 479 00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:23,690 he's got perspective on on that property 480 00:22:29,620 --> 00:22:25,850 or skinwalker better than all of us so 481 00:22:37,120 --> 00:22:29,630 you know the first said that right well 482 00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:37,130 just wait till two men May 30th was part 483 00:22:43,810 --> 00:22:40,970 of that panel as well yeah yeah I think 484 00:22:45,610 --> 00:22:43,820 I'm I think that this is an extremely 485 00:22:47,850 --> 00:22:45,620 important part and I'm glad they at 486 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:47,860 least brought in a little bit of course 487 00:22:53,830 --> 00:22:50,450 science is very important but the 488 00:22:58,420 --> 00:22:53,840 skinwalker ranch is rooted in uten 489 00:23:00,940 --> 00:22:58,430 Navajo history and without bringing any 490 00:23:02,710 --> 00:23:00,950 of that on it would be a total shame so 491 00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:02,720 I'm glad at least a little bit of that 492 00:23:08,470 --> 00:23:05,050 has brought onto the show but I think 493 00:23:11,350 --> 00:23:08,480 especially for people who may not have 494 00:23:15,790 --> 00:23:11,360 ever looked into the ranch before they 495 00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:15,800 really should dive deep into the not 496 00:23:21,310 --> 00:23:18,290 only that the legends and and what's led 497 00:23:25,270 --> 00:23:21,320 up to this in the history and in 498 00:23:27,730 --> 00:23:25,280 skinwalker the whole ideology behind it 499 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:27,740 it's very important in the spirit 500 00:23:33,010 --> 00:23:30,290 quality like you you said is so 501 00:23:36,700 --> 00:23:33,020 important in that aspect and it's not 502 00:23:39,340 --> 00:23:36,710 without merit look I really appreciate 503 00:23:44,970 --> 00:23:39,350 you saying that Maureen and you know 504 00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:44,980 science and I value what you're saying 505 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:47,210 you know this isn't the typical 506 00:23:51,820 --> 00:23:49,010 interview I think we're concerned about 507 00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:51,830 you know the truth the transparency the 508 00:23:57,970 --> 00:23:55,250 facts the data as they say but I I you 509 00:24:01,840 --> 00:23:57,980 know I I would really an issue money 510 00:24:04,810 --> 00:24:01,850 could email Kevin Burns if he doesn't 511 00:24:07,330 --> 00:24:04,820 know and just say you know the the 512 00:24:11,230 --> 00:24:07,340 bottom line is the science is great but 513 00:24:14,860 --> 00:24:11,240 that's got a mirror in parallel of the 514 00:24:17,140 --> 00:24:14,870 Spirit because the spirit of that ground 515 00:24:19,990 --> 00:24:17,150 up there just the lore of that easement 516 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:20,000 of the skinwalker you can only imagine 517 00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:22,010 you know I mean I get I'm not I'm not 518 00:24:26,169 --> 00:24:24,890 picking sides and not all try oh it's 519 00:24:28,750 --> 00:24:26,179 that aside I don't think it's a side I 520 00:24:31,120 --> 00:24:28,760 think these are they go hand in hand its 521 00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:31,130 history its history and unfortunately 522 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:33,530 you know you get white man going out 523 00:24:40,930 --> 00:24:37,490 there and might is right and you get out 524 00:24:44,110 --> 00:24:40,940 there and they they basically hire the 525 00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:44,120 Utes as their hit man and they utilize 526 00:24:51,490 --> 00:24:47,570 the Navajo as slaves and you can only 527 00:24:53,799 --> 00:24:51,500 imagine the abuse and so you know I 528 00:24:56,020 --> 00:24:53,809 think I think things pick up vibes you 529 00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:56,030 know I mean I know that you know I can 530 00:24:59,669 --> 00:24:57,890 go into a home or you can walk into home 531 00:25:01,600 --> 00:24:59,679 and you can feel the love you know you 532 00:25:03,100 --> 00:25:01,610 it's like an artist 533 00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:03,110 you walk in there think man there's a 534 00:25:07,900 --> 00:25:04,690 lot of love in here I just feel the 535 00:25:09,970 --> 00:25:07,910 spirit you know it feels warm here in 536 00:25:12,250 --> 00:25:09,980 that ranch you get certain people up 537 00:25:14,980 --> 00:25:12,260 there that unfortunately don't have the 538 00:25:17,950 --> 00:25:14,990 underlying motivation obviously you guys 539 00:25:21,220 --> 00:25:17,960 do and you pick up a vibe you know 540 00:25:23,980 --> 00:25:21,230 before before we went out there to to 541 00:25:26,140 --> 00:25:23,990 manage the ranch there was a level of 542 00:25:29,290 --> 00:25:26,150 chaos there was there was a level there 543 00:25:32,049 --> 00:25:29,300 was a contentment there was domestic 544 00:25:33,700 --> 00:25:32,059 issues out there you know where you 545 00:25:34,930 --> 00:25:33,710 start looking back at the history of 546 00:25:37,270 --> 00:25:34,940 some of the people that lived on that 547 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:37,280 ranch where they were putting locks on 548 00:25:41,810 --> 00:25:38,570 doors and 549 00:25:44,360 --> 00:25:41,820 you know I don't want to get into all 550 00:25:46,790 --> 00:25:44,370 all the personal issues out there but 551 00:25:49,430 --> 00:25:46,800 you pick up the vibes you know see ya go 552 00:25:52,310 --> 00:25:49,440 home and yet if they were it's clean 553 00:25:56,660 --> 00:25:52,320 it's neat there's there's pictures on 554 00:25:59,780 --> 00:25:56,670 the wall places is tidy and you sense a 555 00:26:01,340 --> 00:25:59,790 harmony level and and what we're doing 556 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:01,350 the ranch right now is we're trying to 557 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:06,090 be responsible tenants because that 558 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:08,850 ranch hosts us nobody owns the land 559 00:26:13,580 --> 00:26:11,730 we're out there as guests and you go out 560 00:26:16,820 --> 00:26:13,590 there and try to be abusive 561 00:26:18,350 --> 00:26:16,830 whether it be digging or just doing 562 00:26:21,740 --> 00:26:18,360 things that you know shouldn't be done 563 00:26:23,840 --> 00:26:21,750 the land picks it up at D Texas again 564 00:26:25,580 --> 00:26:23,850 it's real simple treat people like you 565 00:26:31,190 --> 00:26:25,590 want to be treated the ground is the 566 00:26:32,390 --> 00:26:31,200 same respect it very well said so I know 567 00:26:35,090 --> 00:26:32,400 you've been going at this for a while I 568 00:26:36,740 --> 00:26:35,100 think Jim it might be a good time for us 569 00:26:39,590 --> 00:26:36,750 to kind of move into the questions for 570 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:39,600 other people online and so what we'll do 571 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:42,810 is so Lorene read some Jason reads some 572 00:26:47,390 --> 00:26:45,570 and I read some um so we'll start 573 00:26:49,310 --> 00:26:47,400 Maureen just I think we'll just go in 574 00:26:51,620 --> 00:26:49,320 the order like we always do guys if that 575 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:51,630 works all right 576 00:26:56,930 --> 00:26:54,210 so actually this this question is from 577 00:26:59,990 --> 00:26:56,940 email and comes from whitefeather he 578 00:27:02,210 --> 00:27:00,000 says or he or she actually I'm not sure 579 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:02,220 says I'm enjoying the show and would 580 00:27:08,540 --> 00:27:04,290 like to ask you concerning the cattle 581 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:08,550 mutilation that was mentioned I thought 582 00:27:13,370 --> 00:27:10,650 there had been more but it was stated 583 00:27:16,820 --> 00:27:13,380 this one happened on the show was the 584 00:27:21,350 --> 00:27:16,830 first one in about ten years so I think 585 00:27:24,140 --> 00:27:21,360 what he's asking is is is this the first 586 00:27:26,360 --> 00:27:24,150 cattle mutilation but it wasn't really a 587 00:27:30,620 --> 00:27:26,370 mutilation in the last ten years you 588 00:27:32,060 --> 00:27:30,630 know what happened before we got out 589 00:27:33,700 --> 00:27:32,070 there and you know we've been out there 590 00:27:37,180 --> 00:27:33,710 for the last four or five years that 591 00:27:40,190 --> 00:27:37,190 cattle mutilation probably actually 592 00:27:43,460 --> 00:27:40,200 would have been before Bigelow's era and 593 00:27:46,850 --> 00:27:43,470 Bigelow was out there for about 17 years 594 00:27:48,790 --> 00:27:46,860 so I have personally interviewed visited 595 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:48,800 with the young man that witnessed it 596 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:51,650 with their canal adei 597 00:27:57,850 --> 00:27:53,930 the recent occurrence that happened this 598 00:28:01,020 --> 00:27:57,860 past summer again from what we can see 599 00:28:04,840 --> 00:28:01,030 in detect was from trauma I you know 600 00:28:08,500 --> 00:28:04,850 being out there that day and what was in 601 00:28:11,049 --> 00:28:08,510 the sky observe enough obviously it 602 00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:11,059 wasn't a mountain lion it was not no 603 00:28:18,100 --> 00:28:15,050 tracks around that but I think once 604 00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:18,110 again it was something to do from the 605 00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:20,330 unknown that we're still trying to 606 00:28:25,299 --> 00:28:22,250 validate but we do have we do have it on 607 00:28:28,360 --> 00:28:25,309 camera and and and you know it's funny 608 00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:28,370 we as we talk to some of the locals it 609 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:30,770 ebbs and flows out there about every so 610 00:28:35,980 --> 00:28:33,890 many years it gets really active out in 611 00:28:37,870 --> 00:28:35,990 the basin and then and then it'll get 612 00:28:40,360 --> 00:28:37,880 very docile and what we're finding right 613 00:28:42,100 --> 00:28:40,370 now it's getting really active again out 614 00:28:44,140 --> 00:28:42,110 there it has nothing to do with the 615 00:28:46,630 --> 00:28:44,150 History Channel cominius trying to 616 00:28:49,200 --> 00:28:46,640 promote a show this is the real deal 617 00:28:53,410 --> 00:28:49,210 there's something going on out there 618 00:28:56,799 --> 00:28:53,420 that is really it's a wake-up call for 619 00:28:59,169 --> 00:28:56,809 us Jason with the questions up to 620 00:29:02,410 --> 00:28:59,179 Twitter questions this first one comes 621 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:02,420 from Halloween mama 88 she asks what 622 00:29:06,430 --> 00:29:04,250 started Jim's interest in the skinwalker 623 00:29:12,570 --> 00:29:06,440 ranch was it prior to working there or 624 00:29:18,190 --> 00:29:12,580 was it long before employment you know I 625 00:29:20,890 --> 00:29:18,200 skinwalkers I you know I really my young 626 00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:20,900 adult life always will interest in the 627 00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:25,250 Native Americans account with days and 628 00:29:32,890 --> 00:29:30,650 evenings up in the Navajo with a Navajo 629 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:32,900 tribe matter of fact became really close 630 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:35,690 to the president of the Navajo President 631 00:29:40,660 --> 00:29:38,690 Joe Shirley he was very gracious in 632 00:29:44,260 --> 00:29:40,670 embracing me on a personal basis 633 00:29:48,610 --> 00:29:44,270 inviting me into some of their personal 634 00:29:53,169 --> 00:29:48,620 ceremony area ceremonies and I remember 635 00:29:55,750 --> 00:29:53,179 one night unfortunately I probably being 636 00:29:57,100 --> 00:29:55,760 a little naive and a white boy I had no 637 00:30:01,140 --> 00:29:57,110 there's a drinking amount of water 638 00:30:04,600 --> 00:30:01,150 coffee before going into a ceremony and 639 00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:04,610 you know Sun Goes Down and you go in and 640 00:30:06,850 --> 00:30:05,450 to 641 00:30:08,889 --> 00:30:06,860 we throw money you don't come out till 642 00:30:10,810 --> 00:30:08,899 the Sun comes up and so but halfway 643 00:30:13,450 --> 00:30:10,820 through I just kind of raised my hand 644 00:30:15,299 --> 00:30:13,460 when the drum stops beat of the drum 645 00:30:19,419 --> 00:30:15,309 would do all right 646 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:19,429 any way that I can go counter clock by 647 00:30:24,549 --> 00:30:22,850 to take a coffee break and then the 648 00:30:27,129 --> 00:30:24,559 president shared with me very candidly 649 00:30:30,190 --> 00:30:27,139 don't go too far I was left with the 650 00:30:32,230 --> 00:30:30,200 choukai and he said there's there's the 651 00:30:35,740 --> 00:30:32,240 potential of skinwalkers out there and I 652 00:30:38,289 --> 00:30:35,750 I thought okay and he had shared with me 653 00:30:41,500 --> 00:30:38,299 many stories that I won't share with you 654 00:30:44,649 --> 00:30:41,510 tonight but I'm pleased other times you 655 00:30:46,950 --> 00:30:44,659 know the shapeshifter and and so I took 656 00:30:52,899 --> 00:30:46,960 you know he had no reason to try to 657 00:30:55,659 --> 00:30:52,909 intimidate me or scare me remember going 658 00:30:57,100 --> 00:30:55,669 out there and and making my visit 659 00:31:00,789 --> 00:30:57,110 outside as quick as I could and that 660 00:31:02,980 --> 00:31:00,799 came back into the fire but I have 661 00:31:05,919 --> 00:31:02,990 always had a real sincere love and 662 00:31:08,259 --> 00:31:05,929 passion to learn about the culture I've 663 00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:08,269 shared with my Native American brothers 664 00:31:13,289 --> 00:31:10,610 and sisters you know I'm happy in my 665 00:31:16,269 --> 00:31:13,299 skin but there's always been a real 666 00:31:18,340 --> 00:31:16,279 yearning I've had to learn more about 667 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:18,350 that culture and I embrace it with the 668 00:31:27,820 --> 00:31:21,730 level of respect and love and humility 669 00:31:30,940 --> 00:31:27,830 some of my favorite memories and friends 670 00:31:33,460 --> 00:31:30,950 are Native Americans and and it goes 671 00:31:36,850 --> 00:31:33,470 back to President Carrie Holton with the 672 00:31:39,820 --> 00:31:36,860 Lenape tribe and and some of our Navajo 673 00:31:44,379 --> 00:31:39,830 friends and I mean it's not just one 674 00:31:47,409 --> 00:31:44,389 tribe I just have had a real respect you 675 00:31:49,629 --> 00:31:47,419 know for their culture and I'm I'll 676 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:49,639 embrace it I love it I'm very 677 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:52,130 open-minded I always tell people when 678 00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:53,450 you're with me it's what I call a 679 00:31:59,019 --> 00:31:56,570 judgment-free zone so answer the 680 00:32:01,840 --> 00:31:59,029 question I have no idea it's just innate 681 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:01,850 ever since I was a child my mother used 682 00:32:08,649 --> 00:32:05,210 to listen to my prayers as I kneeled 683 00:32:10,690 --> 00:32:08,659 beside my bed of my passion my love and 684 00:32:14,460 --> 00:32:10,700 my curiosity for Native Americans so 685 00:32:17,830 --> 00:32:14,470 it's something I've had since day one 686 00:32:19,600 --> 00:32:17,840 thank you for sharing that 687 00:32:23,020 --> 00:32:19,610 next question from Twitter comes from 688 00:32:25,510 --> 00:32:23,030 Jack and this is in relation to you know 689 00:32:28,870 --> 00:32:25,520 the the things that go on the ranch and 690 00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:28,880 the the investigation and the study 691 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:31,250 that's ongoing Jack asks have they 692 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:33,410 considered a shamanistic approach or 693 00:32:39,970 --> 00:32:37,250 considered some of their methods you 694 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:39,980 know that the jack brings it up and I 695 00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:43,210 appreciate the question jack 696 00:32:49,020 --> 00:32:46,250 as we were talking yesterday about you 697 00:32:51,910 --> 00:32:49,030 know the possibilities of another season 698 00:32:54,610 --> 00:32:51,920 and this will put out to to your 699 00:32:56,950 --> 00:32:54,620 audience you know we're really open 700 00:32:59,590 --> 00:32:56,960 minded I'm really enjoying working with 701 00:33:02,380 --> 00:32:59,600 the staff and I think that's that's 702 00:33:05,140 --> 00:33:02,390 probably a great possibility and I think 703 00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:05,150 this probably straumann you know we have 704 00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:10,490 got obviously very cest roots and he's a 705 00:33:17,500 --> 00:33:13,690 real deal so but no I embrace that 706 00:33:20,860 --> 00:33:17,510 question and appreciate you asking it so 707 00:33:23,220 --> 00:33:20,870 thank you yeah I mean that's definitely 708 00:33:26,650 --> 00:33:23,230 something that's gonna be brought up as 709 00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:26,660 a just going forward so stay tuned like 710 00:33:31,300 --> 00:33:28,010 Brendan would like to say you know he 711 00:33:33,820 --> 00:33:31,310 always says that stay tuned so one other 712 00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:33,830 question Jim we have from from Facebook 713 00:33:40,090 --> 00:33:37,970 this is from it says Jesse asks before 714 00:33:42,550 --> 00:33:40,100 your time on the ranch have you ever had 715 00:33:45,070 --> 00:33:42,560 any other quote unquote experiences 716 00:33:47,830 --> 00:33:45,080 again and I think what their meaning is 717 00:33:50,830 --> 00:33:47,840 like paranormal experiences or you know 718 00:33:54,790 --> 00:33:50,840 sightings of UFOs or anything like that 719 00:33:57,160 --> 00:33:54,800 right now I have as a matter of fact I 720 00:34:01,180 --> 00:33:57,170 said on the military advisory board with 721 00:34:04,450 --> 00:34:01,190 the state of Utah with Senator take Garn 722 00:34:07,300 --> 00:34:04,460 and we would go in and out of area 51 723 00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:07,310 and that this one particular day would 724 00:34:11,530 --> 00:34:09,650 start early in the morning if you've 725 00:34:12,940 --> 00:34:11,540 ever been around helicopters you spend a 726 00:34:15,970 --> 00:34:12,950 full day and when you get what you call 727 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:15,980 metal fatigue so we came back in and I 728 00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:19,970 was coming out of Ogden Utah where Hill 729 00:34:26,970 --> 00:34:23,090 Air Force bases and I was developing a 730 00:34:29,380 --> 00:34:26,980 project up around fruit Heights and 731 00:34:31,580 --> 00:34:29,390 stopped over there to look at the 732 00:34:33,860 --> 00:34:31,590 infrastructure to see if the contract 733 00:34:37,490 --> 00:34:33,870 had done what they said they'd done and 734 00:34:39,980 --> 00:34:37,500 I pulled into the collar sack and got 735 00:34:41,390 --> 00:34:39,990 out of my car and looked up and you know 736 00:34:43,670 --> 00:34:41,400 I don't like say I've had a top secret 737 00:34:45,500 --> 00:34:43,680 clearance I've been around you know the 738 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:45,510 latest and the greatest and what you 739 00:34:49,940 --> 00:34:48,450 know supposedly we have and I looked up 740 00:34:53,540 --> 00:34:49,950 and it was if I was looking up at the 741 00:34:54,790 --> 00:34:53,550 ceiling of my home and it was it was 742 00:34:57,470 --> 00:34:54,800 almost surreal 743 00:35:00,520 --> 00:34:57,480 overwhelming to me where that that level 744 00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:00,530 of what I would say metal could just 745 00:35:05,870 --> 00:35:04,530 suspend itself from the air and I looked 746 00:35:08,330 --> 00:35:05,880 around I thought is anybody else seeing 747 00:35:11,390 --> 00:35:08,340 this or just this is my is this a 748 00:35:12,470 --> 00:35:11,400 figment of my imagination God and I you 749 00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:12,480 know unfortunately I didn't have the 750 00:35:17,900 --> 00:35:15,210 presence of mind to pull my iPhone out 751 00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:17,910 and take a photo but I got back in the 752 00:35:24,260 --> 00:35:20,370 car I didn't say a lot about it but when 753 00:35:28,790 --> 00:35:24,270 I started when I got engaged to ask to 754 00:35:32,210 --> 00:35:28,800 co-manage the ranch I started talking to 755 00:35:34,810 --> 00:35:32,220 individuals like Jacque fillet and dr. 756 00:35:37,430 --> 00:35:34,820 Christopher green and how boot off and 757 00:35:41,330 --> 00:35:37,440 individuals like that that that you know 758 00:35:44,510 --> 00:35:41,340 had been around that space and and then 759 00:35:46,610 --> 00:35:44,520 I explained to him the shape of it and 760 00:35:50,420 --> 00:35:46,620 it was almost like yeah yeah Jim which 761 00:35:52,940 --> 00:35:50,430 what you saw was a UFO or you and it 762 00:35:55,700 --> 00:35:52,950 wasn't like there was a lights going 763 00:35:58,160 --> 00:35:55,710 around it there was it was a summer 764 00:36:00,470 --> 00:35:58,170 evening it's probably 7:30 8 o'clock in 765 00:36:06,470 --> 00:36:00,480 the evening crystal clear not a 766 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:06,480 cloudless guy in a metallic [\h__\h] shaped 767 00:36:13,460 --> 00:36:10,410 I would call it a vehicle sky being that 768 00:36:16,370 --> 00:36:13,470 was just it was just there and I had no 769 00:36:18,950 --> 00:36:16,380 reason to you know look for somebody to 770 00:36:21,890 --> 00:36:18,960 embrace me or add a boy or pat me on the 771 00:36:24,950 --> 00:36:21,900 back or ever it was just my own personal 772 00:36:26,510 --> 00:36:24,960 experience and now that we have been 773 00:36:28,910 --> 00:36:26,520 affiliated with the ranch for four or 774 00:36:32,180 --> 00:36:28,920 five years now and you start talking to 775 00:36:33,830 --> 00:36:32,190 people like Travis Taylor and witness 776 00:36:37,220 --> 00:36:33,840 you know people have with us like 777 00:36:40,310 --> 00:36:37,230 Michelle you just go you know what yeah 778 00:36:42,410 --> 00:36:40,320 you know I'm a fact-finder there are 779 00:36:44,689 --> 00:36:42,420 things out there that that I can't 780 00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:44,699 explain but 781 00:36:51,150 --> 00:36:46,930 I've acknowledged them with my eyes and 782 00:36:55,410 --> 00:36:51,160 I'm embracing this opportunity is an 783 00:36:57,959 --> 00:36:55,420 opportunity so yeah the fact that you've 784 00:37:03,779 --> 00:36:57,969 gotten to speak with Jacques filet makes 785 00:37:06,449 --> 00:37:03,789 you way cooler than any of us so that's 786 00:37:09,539 --> 00:37:06,459 a very interesting individual you know 787 00:37:12,359 --> 00:37:09,549 when you talk about presence there's an 788 00:37:13,739 --> 00:37:12,369 aura about him that fills the room and 789 00:37:16,890 --> 00:37:13,749 you know to be honest I felt the same 790 00:37:20,670 --> 00:37:16,900 way with a lot of the people that have 791 00:37:23,189 --> 00:37:20,680 had a sincere in about the skinwalker 792 00:37:26,069 --> 00:37:23,199 ranch and you say what you want to about 793 00:37:28,140 --> 00:37:26,079 this billionaire by the name of mr. 794 00:37:31,349 --> 00:37:28,150 Robert Bigelow but that's a guy there 795 00:37:35,189 --> 00:37:31,359 that you know fills the room he's got a 796 00:37:39,299 --> 00:37:35,199 presence about him a stupidness about 797 00:37:41,130 --> 00:37:39,309 him that you know you you just you go 798 00:37:43,739 --> 00:37:41,140 wow you know that this guy is a man's 799 00:37:45,390 --> 00:37:43,749 man he's been there he's done that it's 800 00:37:48,900 --> 00:37:45,400 obvious that there was something 801 00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:48,910 associated with that ranch otherwise you 802 00:37:55,519 --> 00:37:50,890 wouldn't have twenty thirty million 803 00:37:57,779 --> 00:37:55,529 dollars of of government money you know 804 00:38:00,209 --> 00:37:57,789 associated that ranch and I think what's 805 00:38:02,609 --> 00:38:00,219 going to [\h__\h] what we're gonna find if 806 00:38:05,819 --> 00:38:02,619 the good Lords willing they're the one 807 00:38:08,789 --> 00:38:05,829 that ranch then they were what we're 808 00:38:11,549 --> 00:38:08,799 seeing right now so I'm hoping that with 809 00:38:13,650 --> 00:38:11,559 time and papers and some of the people 810 00:38:17,819 --> 00:38:13,660 who've been associated that ranch the 811 00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:17,829 last 10-15 years I'm hoping that we will 812 00:38:23,489 --> 00:38:20,410 allow them to come forward and tell us 813 00:38:26,459 --> 00:38:23,499 the rest of the story because to be 814 00:38:28,469 --> 00:38:26,469 honest with you I feel like an outsider 815 00:38:31,559 --> 00:38:28,479 looking in that there's people out there 816 00:38:34,559 --> 00:38:31,569 guys that have been there witnessed and 817 00:38:36,660 --> 00:38:34,569 and and one of those is Michelle you 818 00:38:38,999 --> 00:38:36,670 know she's had experiences that that I 819 00:38:43,199 --> 00:38:39,009 can only read about and and to be honest 820 00:38:45,589 --> 00:38:43,209 with you I have no interest embracing or 821 00:38:50,539 --> 00:38:45,599 witnessing some of the experiences that 822 00:38:53,699 --> 00:38:50,549 that they've had it scares me to death 823 00:38:57,059 --> 00:38:53,709 me the way I am naive and also I'll 824 00:38:57,749 --> 00:38:57,069 continue to say no as we go forward you 825 00:39:02,249 --> 00:38:57,759 know 826 00:39:04,380 --> 00:39:02,259 season because I'm putting it all out 827 00:39:06,299 --> 00:39:04,390 there you know fingers are crossed and 828 00:39:08,160 --> 00:39:06,309 everything and we have to get Michelle 829 00:39:09,779 --> 00:39:08,170 on here so we can talk with Michelle as 830 00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:09,789 well because she's played a big part in 831 00:39:15,749 --> 00:39:13,450 this all coming together to it so it 832 00:39:18,359 --> 00:39:15,759 would be great to have her you know 833 00:39:20,700 --> 00:39:18,369 think through you like introducing who 834 00:39:21,950 --> 00:39:20,710 she is and so she can you know talk 835 00:39:24,089 --> 00:39:21,960 about her role and everything too 836 00:39:25,410 --> 00:39:24,099 because this is a big team it's a big 837 00:39:26,609 --> 00:39:25,420 team it's a big family out there and 838 00:39:29,370 --> 00:39:26,619 that was one of the things I try to 839 00:39:31,799 --> 00:39:29,380 explain to people a lot you know it's 840 00:39:33,089 --> 00:39:31,809 not just it's not just a bunch of guys 841 00:39:34,859 --> 00:39:33,099 like these are different it's a 842 00:39:36,779 --> 00:39:34,869 different group of people it's it's not 843 00:39:37,890 --> 00:39:36,789 they're not out there trying to make 844 00:39:40,229 --> 00:39:37,900 money they're not out there trying to 845 00:39:42,809 --> 00:39:40,239 get a show going it's like no these are 846 00:39:46,469 --> 00:39:42,819 genuine people genuine relationships and 847 00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:46,479 it's if you can you know build bonds 848 00:39:49,410 --> 00:39:48,130 with them that's how that's how things 849 00:39:50,999 --> 00:39:49,420 move forward you're not just going to be 850 00:39:52,289 --> 00:39:51,009 like yeah you know I'm a cowboy I'm 851 00:39:53,420 --> 00:39:52,299 coming in to get something done now it 852 00:39:57,630 --> 00:39:53,430 doesn't work that way 853 00:39:59,940 --> 00:39:57,640 it's not you know well well said DJ and 854 00:40:01,410 --> 00:39:59,950 I'll tell you you know I mean I being a 855 00:40:04,259 --> 00:40:01,420 businessman I've met some interesting 856 00:40:07,140 --> 00:40:04,269 people you know the speed winds and guys 857 00:40:09,660 --> 00:40:07,150 that were you know capitalized on Las 858 00:40:11,459 --> 00:40:09,670 Vegas and you know the the Donald 859 00:40:14,219 --> 00:40:11,469 Trump's and the people that you know as 860 00:40:17,370 --> 00:40:14,229 a young developer I was in awe you know 861 00:40:20,819 --> 00:40:17,380 but but the rest of the story is is this 862 00:40:23,670 --> 00:40:20,829 group that has an interest in the facts 863 00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:23,680 and being a fact-finder there are rare 864 00:40:26,279 --> 00:40:24,130 Bunch 865 00:40:28,469 --> 00:40:26,289 they're a very eclectic some of them are 866 00:40:32,279 --> 00:40:28,479 venture capitalists I know they've done 867 00:40:35,459 --> 00:40:32,289 extremely well obviously financially but 868 00:40:37,709 --> 00:40:35,469 it's almost like in some cases very 869 00:40:39,390 --> 00:40:37,719 hand-picked and when you get on the 870 00:40:42,150 --> 00:40:39,400 ranch with some of these people were 871 00:40:47,190 --> 00:40:42,160 there surgeons you know medical doctors 872 00:40:50,099 --> 00:40:47,200 and philanthropic individuals and I mean 873 00:40:52,440 --> 00:40:50,109 I mean the names are legion and you 874 00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:52,450 start talking to them offline about some 875 00:40:59,940 --> 00:40:55,690 of their personal experiences it is 876 00:41:01,859 --> 00:40:59,950 sobering it is humbling so oh great hey 877 00:41:04,950 --> 00:41:01,869 guys I did we're gonna they're gonna 878 00:41:07,079 --> 00:41:04,960 lock up the club here they've been very 879 00:41:10,319 --> 00:41:07,089 good right here a shout out to the 880 00:41:11,069 --> 00:41:10,329 Cottonwood Country Club and guys I don't 881 00:41:12,779 --> 00:41:11,079 mean to cut you 882 00:41:15,299 --> 00:41:12,789 short but just know that my thoughts and 883 00:41:18,140 --> 00:41:15,309 prayers are with all of you and if you 884 00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:18,150 guys want to text me offline 885 00:41:25,319 --> 00:41:21,690 I'm more than happy to be candid and 886 00:41:27,359 --> 00:41:25,329 transparent and just know that I'm here 887 00:41:32,699 --> 00:41:27,369 spiritually with you and appreciate all 888 00:41:37,739 --> 00:41:32,709 that you do okay thank you thank you as 889 00:41:39,539 --> 00:41:37,749 well so that's it for us this week on 890 00:41:41,279 --> 00:41:39,549 skin-walker debrief the TV show 891 00:41:44,089 --> 00:41:41,289 secretive skinwalker ranch is off the 892 00:41:46,259 --> 00:41:44,099 air next week but be sure to join us 893 00:41:48,449 --> 00:41:46,269 next week because we're still going to 894 00:41:49,529 --> 00:41:48,459 be here and we'll have superintendent of 895 00:41:51,959 --> 00:41:49,539 skinwalker ranch 896 00:41:53,890 --> 00:41:51,969 Thomas Winterton so he will catch you 897 00:42:17,380 --> 00:41:53,900 guys later 898 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:17,390 [Music]